no one asked for this update (other than trophy hunters)

General discussion about MCC Island Gameplay
I'm just really confused how/what updates and fixes are prioritized given how much feedback is given? I'm sorry, but no one asked for milestones, no one asked for BB kits to be picked twice, no one asked for quest scroll fusion. Not that some of these updates are good e.g. the spirit shop overhaul, punishment system for leaving BB games, but on the majority I just don't understand why any of this was prioritized?

There are dedicated communities who have a lot of feedback to offer, but over everything, the only community that is ever listened to is the Trophy Hunters Discord; who from what I can tell, directly influenced some of the recent updates, like being able to /inspect without a badge pinned, and the quest milestone mechanics. I don't really see this entirely as a bad thing, I'm glad that at least some part of the community is being heard, but I don't understand why all other feedback seems to be ignored when it's clear Noxcrew can and does communicate with some of their players.

The one time Noxcrew communicated with another community, the HITW Dojo, about recent changes to the game, there was a lot of discussion and disagreement about the change in lobby size, and just an overall frustration that the game is so buggy. I'm glad this was all at least discussed with the HITW community, but the ending sentiment was that there was not enough time/people to fix HITW as in Noxcrew's own words, "it's just in such a bad state (they) need to effectively rewrite the entire wall mechanic." This is fair, and I don't doubt that Noxcrew tries their best, but like with many fixes/updates that haven't come to Island, it just seems like there's not enough people working on Island. This was a bit of a random tangent to say I don't think there are enough devs, but also in relation to the recent update, my frustration is that convoluted economy updates constantly are being rolled out in favor of working on something, at least in my opinion, more important like the entire game of HITW.

Another thing that was mentioned in the thread was that it was important for casual players for the game to be able to queue throughout the day, and I understand that the casual experience is important to consider, but with all that said, who is this update for??? No casual player cares about milestones, no casual player is going to understand all the p2w aspects of the economy, the only people who care about these changes are players who are already spending hundreds on Island.

Whenever updates or changes are brought up for certain games, there always seems to be issues with balancing games to be fun for casual players but also replayable and competitive enough for sweats, but this just isn't consistent with how the Economy is updated. Either make the economy enjoyable for casual players (it's really not fun in any way the way it is now, this post says it all) or actually take feedback from the respective communities when changing games.

Which brings me to my hugest problem with this update: the BB kit change. It's such a ridiculously out of touch and lazy change, it honestly almost ruins the game, removing the team work, bow (not crossbow) skill, and utility usage from BB. Instead of rebalancing kits, so that all the options are about equal, we get 4 quick charge II crossbows with levi orbs in one canal game!!!! In slay, you have to always fight either a gun or an iron sword!!!! I don't know how anyone looked at this change for more than 2 seconds and thought it was the better solution over rebalancing kits. If this was because it was more convenient since 10 player teams are possible in plobbies now, then again, I just think it's lazy.

I don't think I'm the only one who feels this way, I think the huge majority of players think more devs/more communication needs to happen; but if not me or this post, I would just urge anyone working on Island to actually listen to the people playing on the server.
 
Last edited:

Noxcrew

Noxcrew
Jan 25, 2023
4,011
30
noxcrew.com
(This is an automated reply)

Hi there,

Thank you for providing your feedback. We appreciate your help in making MCC Island the best it can be!

While we may not reply to your feedback thread, we want to assure you that your feedback will still be seen and reviewed by the team.

Thank you again for your help!
 
I think there's a few different things to mention:
  • We have different developers working on different features. Changes to the economy are largely disjoint from changes to games. Of course things can be shifted around, and we would if we felt it was necessary, but it depends on whether changing HITW is so important that it warrants that.
  • The best place for feedback is here on the forums, feedback on discord is disjoint and not easy to follow up on. Feedback given here is much easier to go through and easier to keep track of. Forum posts also tend to be more in-depth and opinionated than a one-off opinion on discord. So keep posts like this coming if you have any worries!
  • HITW not being changed is because it would require a lot of work, and we currently don't think that outweighs the importance, but it's not too far off. I started looking into it before the plobbies update but it was a big job and I focussed on plobbies instead. Since then I have been busy with Dynaball, MCC Twitch Rivals, MCC Party, and now this update which consisted of a lot of internal clean-up for future games that wasn't mentioned in the patch notes. Updating HITW is something to look at sometime soon, but it is still not quite the top priority.


Now onto the Battle Box kit change! That change was based a bit on community feedback but no one suggested the exact change, the 2 kit idea specifically was something I pitched and thought would be an interesting change, here's some reasons for adding it:
  • It removes having to pick a kit that you do not like, there is a much bigger chance that you can still pick a kit you like. If you are awful with a bow you shouldn't have the bow-only no sword kit as your only option.
  • It gives players that have longer loading times or that don't insta-lock that one kit more options if someone always snipes the best kit.
  • It shifts the balancing in what I think is a more interesting direction in a communciation-less environment. If there is one powerful option in the event where you can communicate you can strategically assign that to your best player. In an environment without communication having a very strong kit feels worse, because you don't get to have it. If your teammate that took the strong kit doesn't play as well as the enemy on that kit, that feels bad, and I'd like to imagine that giving people 2 kits spreads it out more. Current kits might need some adapting, definitely.
  • It took basically no time to code. It's a blanket change that we can also easily revert if we want to, but it shakes up the game and does something interesting.

Also, I came up with this patch far before I made Battle Box plobbies support 40 players, it wasn't changed for them. I'd keep the 2 kits always on in big plobbies, but it's more of a coincidence and it doesn't matter what it's set to in the main mode. It could even be questioned why it needs to be 2 kits and whether kits can't be unlimited or configurable in the plobby settings.

I'm not against going back to 1 kit selection, but I'm interested in the discussion of how kit balance should work. If we end up sticking with 1 kits but walk away with some new perspectives on kit balance, that's also fine. If kits are so strong it's problematic with 2 max, should that not also be addressed with 1 max? Specific feedback on which kits are problematic is appreciated there!
 
This is just my opinion on the topic.

The milestone mechanic has been a thing Noxcrew has been working on for quite some time, so I'm confused as to what the problem is with that. If the point you're making is the milestone mechanic in quests are behind a paywall (Champ, Grand Champ, and GCR), then I understand.

I'm for the quest scroll fusions because even though I'm not on the trophy grind, I don't like seeing myself have over a stack of common/uncommon quest scroll in my infinibag. I like this change because it allows me to fuse the current quest scrolls that I have for something that has more value, or I can just get absolutely unlucky with RNG XD

I do agree with where you stand with Battle Box regarding 2 players a kit. It could definitely use a rebalance, but I'm just going to have fun with it while it lasts.

I think there's a few different things to mention:
  • We have different developers working on different features. Changes to the economy are largely disjoint from changes to games. Of course things can be shifted around, and we would if we felt it was necessary, but it depends on whether changing HITW is so important that it warrants that.
  • The best place for feedback is here on the forums, feedback on discord is disjoint and not easy to follow up on. Feedback given here is much easier to go through and easier to keep track of. Forum posts also tend to be more in-depth and opinionated than a one-off opinion on discord. So keep posts like this coming if you have any worries!
  • HITW not being changed is because it would require a lot of work, and we currently don't think that outweighs the importance, but it's not too far off. I started looking into it before the plobbies update but it was a big job and I focussed on plobbies instead. Since then I have been busy with Dynaball, MCC Twitch Rivals, MCC Party, and now this update which consisted of a lot of internal clean-up for future games that wasn't mentioned in the patch notes. Updating HITW is something to look at sometime soon, but it is still not quite the top priority.


Now onto the Battle Box kit change! That change was based a bit on community feedback but no one suggested the exact change, the 2 kit idea specifically was something I pitched and thought would be an interesting change, here's some reasons for adding it:
  • It removes having to pick a kit that you do not like, there is a much bigger chance that you can still pick a kit you like. If you are awful with a bow you shouldn't have the bow-only no sword kit as your only option.
  • It gives players that have longer loading times or that don't insta-lock that one kit more options if someone always snipes the best kit.
  • It shifts the balancing in what I think is a more interesting direction in a communciation-less environment. If there is one powerful option in the event where you can communicate you can strategically assign that to your best player. In an environment without communication having a very strong kit feels worse, because you don't get to have it. If your teammate that took the strong kit doesn't play as well as the enemy on that kit, that feels bad, and I'd like to imagine that giving people 2 kits spreads it out more. Current kits might need some adapting, definitely.
  • It took basically no time to code. It's a blanket change that we can also easily revert if we want to, but it shakes up the game and does something interesting.

Also, I came up with this patch far before I made Battle Box plobbies support 40 players, it wasn't changed for them. I'd keep the 2 kits always on in big plobbies, but it's more of a coincidence and it doesn't matter what it's set to in the main mode. It could even be questioned why it needs to be 2 kits and whether kits can't be unlimited or configurable in the plobby settings.

I'm not against going back to 1 kit selection, but I'm interested in the discussion of how kit balance should work. If we end up sticking with 1 kits but walk away with some new perspectives on kit balance, that's also fine. If kits are so strong it's problematic with 2 max, should that not also be addressed with 1 max? Specific feedback on which kits are problematic is appreciated there!
As someone who strongly plays Hole in the Wall, my only feedback is to increase the amount of experience given to the players, since the lobby size ranges from 8 to 12.

I was thinking about the insta-locking situation with Battle Box, but I don't think that removes the insta-lock issue at all. Maybe lowers it, but not to 0.

Now I can see why have 2 players on one kit is a problem and I think a rebalance can be worked out (i.e., replacing iron swords w/ stone swords for scrapper kit in Slay). I'm still going to try and have fun with this change and hope the rebalance does work out. But when it comes to plobbies, having 2 players per kit makes sense for a large plobby of 20+ players. As for regular BB gameplay, one player per kit is the better route.

Hopefully in the near future, there will be some resolutions for rebalancing BB, but overall, I'm pretty happy with this update.
 
Last edited:
I think there's a few different things to mention:
  • We have different developers working on different features. Changes to the economy are largely disjoint from changes to games. Of course things can be shifted around, and we would if we felt it was necessary, but it depends on whether changing HITW is so important that it warrants that.
  • The best place for feedback is here on the forums, feedback on discord is disjoint and not easy to follow up on. Feedback given here is much easier to go through and easier to keep track of. Forum posts also tend to be more in-depth and opinionated than a one-off opinion on discord. So keep posts like this coming if you have any worries!
  • HITW not being changed is because it would require a lot of work, and we currently don't think that outweighs the importance, but it's not too far off. I started looking into it before the plobbies update but it was a big job and I focussed on plobbies instead. Since then I have been busy with Dynaball, MCC Twitch Rivals, MCC Party, and now this update which consisted of a lot of internal clean-up for future games that wasn't mentioned in the patch notes. Updating HITW is something to look at sometime soon, but it is still not quite the top priority.


Now onto the Battle Box kit change! That change was based a bit on community feedback but no one suggested the exact change, the 2 kit idea specifically was something I pitched and thought would be an interesting change, here's some reasons for adding it:
  • It removes having to pick a kit that you do not like, there is a much bigger chance that you can still pick a kit you like. If you are awful with a bow you shouldn't have the bow-only no sword kit as your only option.
  • It gives players that have longer loading times or that don't insta-lock that one kit more options if someone always snipes the best kit.
  • It shifts the balancing in what I think is a more interesting direction in a communciation-less environment. If there is one powerful option in the event where you can communicate you can strategically assign that to your best player. In an environment without communication having a very strong kit feels worse, because you don't get to have it. If your teammate that took the strong kit doesn't play as well as the enemy on that kit, that feels bad, and I'd like to imagine that giving people 2 kits spreads it out more. Current kits might need some adapting, definitely.
  • It took basically no time to code. It's a blanket change that we can also easily revert if we want to, but it shakes up the game and does something interesting.

Also, I came up with this patch far before I made Battle Box plobbies support 40 players, it wasn't changed for them. I'd keep the 2 kits always on in big plobbies, but it's more of a coincidence and it doesn't matter what it's set to in the main mode. It could even be questioned why it needs to be 2 kits and whether kits can't be unlimited or configurable in the plobby settings.

I'm not against going back to 1 kit selection, but I'm interested in the discussion of how kit balance should work. If we end up sticking with 1 kits but walk away with some new perspectives on kit balance, that's also fine. If kits are so strong it's problematic with 2 max, should that not also be addressed with 1 max? Specific feedback on which kits are problematic is appreciated there!
Okay, so I’m not a BB player but I have a potential solution to the aforementioned issues:

Put every item into a GUI - orbs, splashes, bows, enchants, swords, etc.

Create a shop like GUI - every player gets 100 “credits” at the start of the game that they can spend on one of each category (weapons, assist (like orbs), and defense (gaps and maybe armour)). Make it so that no player HAS to have a bow or a sword, instead that you get to pick what you use, and only two people can have a specific item - ie two people can have heal orbs, no more.

Then, to incentivise this system, add in an eco change. Essentially, the less credits you spend in a battle box game, the more coins you get at the end. Won a game with no weapon? COINS. Lasted with only a harming potion and good comms? COINS.

I think this could be a super fun change and a good way to balance things out without making kits feel stale.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ice_Game
Okay, so I’m not a BB player but I have a potential solution to the aforementioned issues:

Put every item into a GUI - orbs, splashes, bows, enchants, swords, etc.

Create a shop like GUI - every player gets 100 “credits” at the start of the game that they can spend on one of each category (weapons, assist (like orbs), and defense (gaps and maybe armour)). Make it so that no player HAS to have a bow or a sword, instead that you get to pick what you use, and only two people can have a specific item - ie two people can have heal orbs, no more.
Also not a BB player (or Island in general much right now tbh), but this just feels a bit overengineered and slow for how little time you have in the pre-game. Especially the last part; that feels like a bandage fix to make sure a team isn't all running a QC2 crossbow and the like. Better kit balance and adding more fun items (love them or hate them, crossbows are pretty fun to use) are ideal imo
 
  • We have different developers working on different features. Changes to the economy are largely disjoint from changes to games. Of course things can be shifted around, and we would if we felt it was necessary, but it depends on whether changing HITW is so important that it warrants that.

1. I understand that things get worked on by different people, but I don't really see why that changes the standard? Like I said, games being balanced for both casual and sweaty experiences is fine if it needs to happen, so then I don't really understand why the same doesn't apply for the economy just because different people are working on it. I could just not be seeing the full picture of what decision making goes on behind the scenes, but it's just extremely frustrating to see one community be able to just ask for a feature and receive it, or be able to discuss updates that will affect the casual experience and make it more and more pay to win, when the BB community is not communicated with at all about such a major change that frankly, ruins the game. In an ideal world, I would love to see both BB and the economy be more casual friendly, less p2w, and have changes based on feedback taken from the people who care about that aspect of MCCI, but I know it's a lot to ask, I just wish there was some consistency in how feedback was taken, as there seems to be no regard for casuals in terms of the economy (yume's post), and little to no communication about competitive changes across the games (hitw, bb).

1701911303472.png

1701912460614.png


  • The best place for feedback is here on the forums, feedback on discord is disjoint and not easy to follow up on. Feedback given here is much easier to go through and easier to keep track of. Forum posts also tend to be more in-depth and opinionated than a one-off opinion on discord. So keep posts like this coming if you have any worries!
2. As shown earlier, I honestly just don't really believe it's impossible for Noxcrew to communicate with the community on Discord (someone asked for something and literally easily got that feature), but even if it was, there have been posts here that just haven't been addressed despite how much attention they get, like yume's, or ones that have offered better solutions to rebalancing kits like these:
Battle Box kit rebalance
Kits on Villa need changing

  • HITW not being changed is because it would require a lot of work, and we currently don't think that outweighs the importance, but it's not too far off. I started looking into it before the plobbies update but it was a big job and I focussed on plobbies instead. Since then I have been busy with Dynaball, MCC Twitch Rivals, MCC Party, and now this update which consisted of a lot of internal clean-up for future games that wasn't mentioned in the patch notes. Updating HITW is something to look at sometime soon, but it is still not quite the top priority.
3. I'm not really one to speak with about HITW since I don't really play it, I just know the lobby size changes were upsetting to a lot of players who main the game, but I still share the sentiment that it feels like feedback is not really taken from the community actually knows the game well, or that fixes and changes are pushed aside for later in favor of other things (mainly economy things, like the mastery gate, milestones, rng events like the Halloween hunt, that once again, circle back to the economy). If that's just where priority has to be rather than the play-ability of the actual games, I can't really say much, I just think a lot of people don't care about trophies or prestiging or milestones, they'd rather see improvements in the games.

cont.. (I just don't want this to delete on accident LOL)
 
Last edited:
Also not a BB player (or Island in general much right now tbh), but this just feels a bit overengineered and slow for how little time you have in the pre-game. Especially the last part; that feels like a bandage fix to make sure a team isn't all running a QC2 crossbow and the like. Better kit balance and adding more fun items (love them or hate them, crossbows are pretty fun to use) are ideal imo
I just suggested this because it’s a similar system to Valorant and I know that a bunch of BB players enjoy that game
 
I just suggested this because it’s a similar system to Valorant and I know that a bunch of BB players enjoy that game
Admittedly I don't play Valorant, but doesn't it let you get new stuff partially into a game? The credit system makes sense for those kinds of games (it's even in typical Bedwars), but I don't think it makes sense for things given at the start.
 
  • It removes having to pick a kit that you do not like, there is a much bigger chance that you can still pick a kit you like. If you are awful with a bow you shouldn't have the bow-only no sword kit as your only option.
  • It gives players that have longer loading times or that don't insta-lock that one kit more options if someone always snipes the best kit.

On to BB:

1. The change does not even fully fix the auto kit locking problem with BB, and like I mentioned, a lot of the problems with BB kits are just way more easily solved by actually rebalancing the kits themselves so there isn't an obvious one or two that are better than the rest.

  • It shifts the balancing in what I think is a more interesting direction in a communciation-less environment. If there is one powerful option in the event where you can communicate you can strategically assign that to your best player. In an environment without communication having a very strong kit feels worse, because you don't get to have it. If your teammate that took the strong kit doesn't play as well as the enemy on that kit, that feels bad, and I'd like to imagine that giving people 2 kits spreads it out more. Current kits might need some adapting, definitely.
2. I can see the reasoning behind this, but on a practical level, it just does not work, especially with the queues that Island has right now. Or at the very least, what you gain from being able to pick a kit you want when solo queuing does not outweigh the problems that this change causes. Especially after playing BB with update, the only map that really benefits from this is Pipes (I've always thought everyone should have a crossbow, or no crossbows at all regardless) because people can take (somewhat) fair 1v1s; with the rest, it's extremely easy for a solo queuer to stumble upon a team with a busted combination of items (like Gadgeteer and Healer on Ships) and makes the game even worse for those players.

Just in general, this change is not worth the one the thing it's supposed to fix (non-communicating solo queuers not getting a kit they want), especially when it doesn't even fully fix it. It takes away any skill in healing, because you can just spam and rush with a team, it takes away skill in using a bow rather than a crossbow, and takes away many different strategies and teamwork involved when playing competitively because different kits are supposed to serve different roles.

I'm not against going back to 1 kit selection, but I'm interested in the discussion of how kit balance should work. If we end up sticking with 1 kits but walk away with some new perspectives on kit balance, that's also fine. If kits are so strong it's problematic with 2 max, should that not also be addressed with 1 max? Specific feedback on which kits are problematic is appreciated there!
3. I think a lot of people have stated how some kits are problematic, and that they need to be rebalanced-- that was the whole issue behind BB, kits that weren't as good as others, not that the kit couldn't be picked an unlimited amount of times. I just don't really understand how this update was a better solution in any way than rebalancing.

For that sort of discussion, I would really hope any more feedback on kit balancing, besides the posts I linked, is listened to from the BB community. If it cannot be found here on the forums, I'd still take a revert to the 1 kit per team max over the change, it just ruins the game more than it helps.
 
I fail to see how these changes were "asked by nobody other than trophy hunters." Yes, it's true that Chase does happen to come to the TH Discord for feedback quite often, but I fail to see how what was updated was influenced by us in any form. Like, at least to my understanding, Chase mainly focuses on the general aspects of the game, which mainly turns out to be the economy. Yes, he turned to the Trophy Hunters Discord for some feedback on some theoretical changes, but by no means did we give him the idea for Quest Scroll Fusion for example, that was entirely his idea that he asked for feedback on. (Quick edit to clarify something, milestones were 100% coming next regardless of what anyone in the TH Discord had to say, they were obviously going to be the next step of Chase's economy overhaul, again, regardless of what the TH Discord said or did.)

Furthermore, about your point on Milestones, I don't understand how you came to the conclusion that "No casual player cares about milestones, no casual player is going to understand all the p2w aspects of the economy, the only people who care about these changes are players who are already spending hundreds on Island." This is blatantly wrong.
While milestones do also benefit people who spend money on MCCI, imo it has an even larger benefit for the F2P players, as it actually allows them to progress at a rate much more comparable to people who spent money prior to this change. The addition of Boosted Quests and an extra daily quest slot for a Rare, Epic & Legendary daily are, by almost all accounts, beneficial to the F2P community. Obviously casual players won't care nearly as much about the economy as trophy hunters or other dedicated players, but that's very much expected, as the part of the player base that would care about these more nuanced changed would be the dedicated player base.

Also just one last comment about the TH community influencing this update by allowing /inspect to view wardrobe and badge trophies without having an equipped cosmetic/pinned badge; okay? It's a super minor change that likely didn't take much time to code, so I don't see how this is an issue considering it's just a small QoL feature. I feel like this is just misplaced anger or dissatisfaction. Obviously the update isn't perfect, nothing is, but that's solved with constructive criticism, not blindly saying the issue is that trophy hunters had too much say in this update when that's just not even close to the truth.
I get it may seem as if there's favoritism towards the TH community if you go into the discord and pick out random messages by devs (mainly Chase), but if you've been an active member of the community, which I'm sure other people from that com can vouch, Chase just pops in periodically to ask for advice or just generally chat. We basically have little to no influence other than bringing some stuff to his attention, such as the /inspect change mentioned before (which as I said, I'd imagine that took basically no time to code) or other random small bugs that we've found on occasion.
I definitely agree more communication across the board would be nice to see, but this feels like a bit of an attack on the TH Community, even though it's completely unwarranted.

Also just a quick note on the BB changes, yeah you're 100% right. Kit balancing would've been an infinitely better solution than allowing players to pick a kit twice as opposed to 1 player per kit. Feels like a weird change.
 
Last edited:
I fail to see how these changes were "asked by nobody other than trophy hunters." Yes, it's true that Chase does happen to come to the TH Discord for feedback quite often, but I fail to see how what was updated was influenced by us in any form. Like, at least to my understanding, Chase mainly focuses on the general aspects of the game, which mainly turns out to be the economy. Yes, he turned to the Trophy Hunters Discord for some feedback on some theoretical changes, but by no means did we give him the idea for Quest Scroll Fusion for example, that was entirely his idea that he asked for feedback on. (Quick edit to clarify something, milestones were 100% coming next regardless of what anyone in the TH Discord had to say, they were obviously going to be the next step of Chase's economy overhaul, again, regardless of what the TH Discord said or did.)

Furthermore, about your point on Milestones, I don't understand how you came to the conclusion that "No casual player cares about milestones, no casual player is going to understand all the p2w aspects of the economy, the only people who care about these changes are players who are already spending hundreds on Island." This is blatantly wrong.
While milestones do also benefit people who spend money on MCCI, imo it has an even larger benefit for the F2P players, as it actually allows them to progress at a rate much more comparable to people who spent money prior to this change. The addition of Boosted Quests and an extra daily quest slot for a Rare, Epic & Legendary daily are, by almost all accounts, beneficial to the F2P community. Obviously casual players won't care nearly as much about the economy as trophy hunters or other dedicated players, but that's very much expected, as the part of the player base that would care about these more nuanced changed would be the dedicated player base.

Also just one last comment about the TH community influencing this update by allowing /inspect to view wardrobe and badge trophies without having an equipped cosmetic/pinned badge; okay? It's a super minor change that likely didn't take much time to code, so I don't see how this is an issue considering it's just a small QoL feature. I feel like this is just misplaced anger or dissatisfaction. Obviously the update isn't perfect, nothing is, but that's solved with constructive criticism, not blindly saying the issue is that trophy hunters had too much say in this update when that's just not even close to the truth.
I get it may come across as such if you just go into the Discord and pick out random messages by devs (mainly Chase), but if you've been an active member of the community, which I'm sure other people from that com can vouch, Chase just pops in periodically to ask for advice or just generally chat. We basically have little to no influence other than bringing some stuff to his attention, such as the /inspect change mentioned before (which as I said, I'd imagine that took basically no time to code) or other random small bugs that we've found on occasion.
I definitely agree more communication across the board would be nice to see, but I feel like this is a bit of an attack on the TH Community, even though it feels completely unwarranted.

I'm sorry but in the kindest way, where is this coming from? I never criticized Trophy Hunters in the slightest and there is no misplaced anger or dissatisfaction; I'm giving feedback in a feedback forum for MCC Island, not coming into TH and criticizing your community, so I don't really get where the defensiveness is coming from? I think it's great that at least a part of the community is being listened to, especially in regards to the parts of the server they care about, like the economy for TH, and I didn't come here to really criticize the Milestones themselves, or the quest scroll fusion; there are some good aspects to this update. My problem is why these aspects of the server are better communicated and prioritized the most, when other games and their changes are getting neglected, or just bad updates on the whole.

...the only community that is ever listened to is the Trophy Hunters Discord; who from what I can tell, directly influenced some of the recent updates, like being able to /inspect without a badge pinned, and the quest milestone mechanics. I don't really see this entirely as a bad thing, I'm glad that at least some part of the community is being heard...
In an ideal world, I would love to see both BB and the economy be more casual friendly, less p2w, and have changes based on feedback taken from the people who care about that aspect of MCCI...

I'm not trying to take away whatever communication or input TH may have, but that community is only a part of the whole server, and it'd be a bit out of touch to deny that a lot of the features in the economy are not fun and not rewarding enough for a lot of the people outside of that community. If milestones and such are important to the "dedicated player base" that's fine and great, but BB kits also matter to their community and changes also need to be communicated.

Anyway, I just think it's a bit hypocritical to claim I'm making false statements while saying stuff like I'm
blindly saying the issue is that trophy hunters had too much say in this update
Creating a strawman argument over this nonissue just doesn't do much for the server xd
 
I'm sorry but in the kindest way, where is this coming from? I never criticized Trophy Hunters in the slightest and there is no misplaced anger or dissatisfaction; I'm giving feedback in a feedback forum for MCC Island, not coming into TH and criticizing your community, so I don't really get where the defensiveness is coming from? I think it's great that at least a part of the community is being listened to, especially in regards to the parts of the server they care about, like the economy for TH...
Yeah, in retrospect you're 100% right, I have no clue what got into me lol. I believe that I just misunderstood your central argument due to the formatting of the post, but that honestly could've stemmed from like a million different things lol.

...and I didn't come here to really criticize the Milestones themselves, or the quest scroll fusion; there are some good aspects to this update. My problem is why these aspects of the server are better communicated and prioritized the most, when other games and their changes are getting neglected, or just bad updates on the whole.
In regards to the update itself, you're definitely right. My personal theory behind why the economy aspects of the server are communicated more is that it just comes down to how each individual dev operates, and it just so happens that Chase tends to interact with the community more as opposed to other devs. I think the disparity between "priorities" just comes down to the fact that different devs work on different things, and having, for example, Chase work on a BB update doesn't really make sense at this moment in time when he could work on finishing up the economy changes that he's been working on for months.

I'm not trying to take away whatever communication or input TH may have, but that community is only a part of the whole server, and it'd be a bit out of touch to deny that a lot of the features in the economy are not fun and not rewarding enough for a lot of the people outside of that community. If milestones and such are important to the "dedicated player base" that's fine and great, but BB kits also matter to their community and changes also need to be communicated.
Again, you're 100% right. What I was trying to say was that each part of the update are individually important, and it's possible to praise one part of the update without criticizing the other. I get that this probably wasn't your intent, and that just comes down to me misunderstanding your argument.

Anyway, I just think it's a bit hypocritical to claim I'm making false statements while saying stuff like I'm

Creating a strawman argument over this nonissue just doesn't do much for the server xd
Again, this was just me misunderstanding the core of your argument, which likely stemmed from the title of your post? Honestly I'm not even 100% sure lol. But yes you're right, generally speaking, people creating strawman arguments is just unhealthy overall. That obviously was not my intent, and if it came across as such, then I apologize.
 
Yeah, in retrospect you're 100% right, I have no clue what got into me lol. I believe that I just misunderstood your central argument due to the formatting of the post, but that honestly could've stemmed from like a million different things lol.


In regards to the update itself, you're definitely right. My personal theory behind why the economy aspects of the server are communicated more is that it just comes down to how each individual dev operates, and it just so happens that Chase tends to interact with the community more as opposed to other devs. I think the disparity between "priorities" just comes down to the fact that different devs work on different things, and having, for example, Chase work on a BB update doesn't really make sense at this moment in time when he could work on finishing up the economy changes that he's been working on for months.


Again, you're 100% right. What I was trying to say was that each part of the update are individually important, and it's possible to praise one part of the update without criticizing the other. I get that this probably wasn't your intent, and that just comes down to me misunderstanding your argument.


Again, this was just me misunderstanding the core of your argument, which likely stemmed from the title of your post? Honestly I'm not even 100% sure lol. But yes you're right, generally speaking, people creating strawman arguments is just unhealthy overall. That obviously was not my intent, and if it came across as such, then I apologize.

you're all good lol, appreciate you took the time to get what i was trying to say, and yeah about the title, it was a bit aggressive, but i'm also just coming out of a lot of frustration and annoyance with island right now, so i can see where you're coming from, no bad blood from me :thumbs_up:
 
  • Like
Reactions: MrGamez
you're all good lol, appreciate you took the time to get what i was trying to say, and yeah about the title, it was a bit aggressive, but i'm also just coming out of a lot of frustration and annoyance with island right now, so i can see where you're coming from, no bad blood from me :thumbs_up:
Yeah, good to hear lol, I can understand where you’re coming from. No bad blood here either, ofc :smile:
 
Yeah, in large part I agree. The TH community really is the only one devs consistently interact with (as a member I'm not complaining about the interaction), and I think it would benefit the community if they at least checked in on different communities now and then. With the TH community being a hub of every top player/p2w player, a lot of suggestions or feedback we have in mind IS geared towards us, or problems we face specifically. I personally think it is cool how much devs (specifically Chase and Kezz) interact with this community, and answer questions or ask for feedback. I also really enjoy being able to provide suggestions that Chase actually listens to and might add. I love the interaction aspect with the dev team, and the time that Chase puts into interacting with the TH community. I do however agree, that more time needs to be spent in different communities (even if it means slightly less time in the TH discord). While the TH discord is home to people who know the most about the economy and bugs, and care A LOT about how the server functions, I can understand the frustration of feeling like the devs aren't listening. I hope the dev team still pays attention to the TH community, as I feel the care and attention to detail there should not go unnoticed, changes like the bb kit change were abysmal, and I did not like the idea of them. The economy changes were largely positive, while some game changes were less positive. I still liked the update though, and thank you so much Chase for listening to our economy suggestions, and adding some of them to the server.
 
I disagree with milestones not really being important, since (especially with all the other p2w aspects to the server) they are a big (and needed) buff to gaining more resources by just playing, but I agree with the majority of other things mentioned here. I also do believe that milestones (and quest scroll fusing, which is something I also generally really like) could be implemented or explained a bit better, since like a lot of other systems of the economy it's a bit convoluted and hard to understand as a casual player.

Trophy hunters is just a very specific case of Chase naturally being the most communicative dev I think, but the disparity in effective feedback and community involvement stemming from it is definitely still an issue imo. After barely feeling like any feedback is having any impact for months, suddenly seeing one specific subsection of the community getting way better treatment is frustrating, even if that communcation being there in the first place is great. This specifically happening to be an economy focused community also doesn't really help with that, considering a lot of gameplay feedback felt neglected while the state of some games just keeps deteriorating (in my experience particularly HITW until recently and Battle Box still).

All things considered communication is currently improving a lot from my - albeit somewhat HITW centric - perspective after what happened with the HITW changes recently, but I do think that other communities definitely still need to be heard more, and the Battle Box community was already one that desperately needed more communcation before this update even happened.

I do think having island specific testers is going to help with these issues, as I'm assuming some of the accepted testers will be more in touch with the community, but that doesn't change that the pathway for regular players to get their feedback heard and them actually feeling heard needs to improve.

If the forums are supposed to be a better place for feedback than discord servers, then there NEEDS to be more communcation on here on the received feedback, because - outside of some issues from new patches dropping - there is close to none, and a lot of stuff feels (not saying it is) like it's being ignored. The way it feels right now to me is that the best way to give feedback is getting lucky a noxcrew member randomly appears in your discord server and sees it, which is... not amazing.

Also on the Battle Box kit changes specifically: Yeah this really shouldn't make its way into the game, the way it's done currently it rips apart everything about how the kits are part of the game's identity, and while I think there might be interesting ways of implementing multiple of the same kit, I do not believe that it would ever work unless the kits are better balanced in the first place, which is the most needed change here anyways.
 
I disagree with everything in this post, the changes are really good and I enjoy them. I'm not a trophy hunter, but I'm still happy with the update.

That said, I do hate the Battle Box kit changes! I think that it should be reverted, it's just so unbalanced.
 
1. I understand that things get worked on by different people, but I don't really see why that changes the standard? Like I said, games being balanced for both casual and sweaty experiences is fine if it needs to happen, so then I don't really understand why the same doesn't apply for the economy just because different people are working on it. I could just not be seeing the full picture of what decision making goes on behind the scenes, but it's just extremely frustrating to see one community be able to just ask for a feature and receive it, or be able to discuss updates that will affect the casual experience and make it more and more pay to win, when the BB community is not communicated with at all about such a major change that frankly, ruins the game. In an ideal world, I would love to see both BB and the economy be more casual friendly, less p2w, and have changes based on feedback taken from the people who care about that aspect of MCCI, but I know it's a lot to ask, I just wish there was some consistency in how feedback was taken, as there seems to be no regard for casuals in terms of the economy (yume's post), and little to no communication about competitive changes across the games (hitw, bb).

View attachment 10298
View attachment 10299


2. As shown earlier, I honestly just don't really believe it's impossible for Noxcrew to communicate with the community on Discord (someone asked for something and literally easily got that feature), but even if it was, there have been posts here that just haven't been addressed despite how much attention they get, like yume's, or ones that have offered better solutions to rebalancing kits like these:
Battle Box kit rebalance
Kits on Villa need changing


3. I'm not really one to speak with about HITW since I don't really play it, I just know the lobby size changes were upsetting to a lot of players who main the game, but I still share the sentiment that it feels like feedback is not really taken from the community actually knows the game well, or that fixes and changes are pushed aside for later in favor of other things (mainly economy things, like the mastery gate, milestones, rng events like the Halloween hunt, that once again, circle back to the economy). If that's just where priority has to be rather than the play-ability of the actual games, I can't really say much, I just think a lot of people don't care about trophies or prestiging or milestones, they'd rather see improvements in the games.

cont.. (I just don't want this to delete on accident LOL)
1. Chase designs the economy changes and can decide what to change, so sending them a discord message about that to convincing them of an idea works. Chase can then prioritise it and put it on the roadmap if he thinks it's a good change he agrees with. Game changes come down to Landlord or me, and trying to get more of the community's opinion is why I'm here typing to you! I see the 2 kit change largely as a casual change, see my reasons above which I feel all lean in the casual direction. I really do not agree it ruins the game outright. I don't quite see why having the game you have already played for a year stay the same for longer is preferable over shaking it up somewhat, I'd rather make some change that opens the road to find a more interesting state for the game through further iteration. I think there's a lot of valid feedback being given, but a lot of it are things that are frustrations that still applied with 1 kit system. They should be solved, but they are not solely caused by 2 kits. Also, there are casual targetted economy changes, and there are discussions about things like that, but an economy is interacted with the most by the most dedicated players so the deepest parts of the systems are understandably aimed at them.

2. I've sent both to Landlord who has a better understanding of the kit balance and we'll talk about the state of kit balance and how 2 kits has shaken that up.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.